Episode Summary
Joe Gidjunis, creator of the PBS documentary series "Grown Up Dad," joins Chance Seales to explore what it means to be a father in the modern era. Their conversation reveals why this might be the best time in history to be a dad, while acknowledging the unique challenges and opportunities that come with contemporary fatherhood.
Meet Joe
Joe Gidjunis is a filmmaker and father who created the documentary series "Grown Up Dad" for PBS. The series explores the complexities of modern fatherhood through five episodes covering topics like maintaining friendships, affording childcare, gender roles, and managing screen time. Joe lives in Philadelphia with his wife, nine-year-old son Gabe, and their dog.
Grown Up Dad is a nonprofit endeavor. You can help them explore more facets of fatherhood through donations.
Key Topics Discussed
The Evolution of Fatherhood
Joe shares striking statistics from Pew Research that illuminate how dramatically fatherhood has changed:
In 1965, the average father spent just 2.5 hours per week with his children
By 2016, this increased to 8 hours per week and will likely keep rising
However, this is still less than the time many men spend watching television weekly
The conversation explores how today's fathers have unprecedented freedom to define their role, unlike previous generations who followed more rigid, provider-focused models.
Personal Journeys and Family Dynamics
Joe and Chance reflect on their relationships with their own fathers and how those experiences shaped their approach to parenting. Joe discusses his father's "drive-by parenting" style, working out of town and being present only 2-3 days per month during Joe's childhood. This absence motivated Joe to pursue a more engaged approach with his own son.
Chance shares his initial concerns about teaching traditionally masculine activities to his twin sons before realizing that authentic connection matters more than conforming to archetypes.
The Search for Role Models
A fascinating segment explores the challenge of finding positive father figures in popular culture. Joe discusses how traditional TV dads like Al Bundy and Tim "The Tool Man" Taylor, while lovable, represented bumbling figures rather than aspirational models.
The conversation takes an unexpected turn when Joe reveals his primary parenting inspiration: Bandit Heeler from the Australian animated series "Bluey." Joe argues that Bandit represents the best-written TV dad in history, noting that the character's appeal stems from being "great for seven minutes at a time" - the length of each episode - rather than maintaining impossible perfection.
The Economics of Modern Parenthood
The discussion addresses how economic factors significantly impact modern parenting:
Children have become "luxury items" due to rising costs
Higher educational attainment often correlates with later parenthood, potentially bringing more patience and perspective
Many families want more children but cannot afford them
The challenge of childcare costs affects family planning decisions
Age and Perspective in Parenting
Joe became a father at 33, his wife at 35 (technically classified as "geriatric pregnancy"). They explore how older parenthood can bring advantages like greater emotional maturity, financial stability, and life perspective, while acknowledging the energy advantages of younger parents.
Class and Accessibility in Fatherhood
The conversation touches on how socioeconomic factors affect fathering experiences. Joe shares insights from interviewing fathers across different economic backgrounds, noting that some working-class fathers need explicit permission to engage in play with their children - something that wasn't always modeled for them.
Equity in Household Responsibilities
Joe reframes the concept of household equity, arguing it's not about maintaining perfect 50-50 splits but rather about partners working together to reach 100% as a team. He emphasizes that some days both parents might only have 20% energy to give, requiring creative collaboration to meet family needs.
The discussion includes data suggesting that European countries with higher birth rates correlate with greater equity in household responsibilities between partners.
Social Connections and Male Friendship
A significant portion of the conversation addresses the challenge of maintaining friendships as fathers. Key insights include:
Men often rely on their wives for social connections
Making friends as an adult requires intentional effort and skills not taught in traditional settings
Joe's prescription: "couples night every Friday and guys night every other weekend"
The former Surgeon General Vivek Murthy's research on loneliness particularly affects men
Men typically prefer activity-based bonding over conversation-focused socializing
Practical Friendship Building
Joe suggests several approaches for fathers seeking social connections:
Sports leagues and recreational activities
Structured activities like building projects
Taking advantage of children's activities to meet other parents
Being intentional about asking friends to spend time together
Screen Time and Competition
The discussion covers the challenge of managing children's screen time and competitive behavior. Joe shares his experience with his son's difficulty handling losses in games, whether board games or video games. His solution involved creating alternative activities (installing a ping-pong table in the basement) that became bonding opportunities.
Key strategies discussed:
Addressing perfectionism in children early
Emphasizing process over outcomes
Finding activities that naturally limit screen time
Using competitive activities as conversation starters
Practical Takeaways for Fathers
Building Social Connections
Give yourself permission to maintain and create new friendships as an adult
Engage in activity-based bonding opportunities
Be intentional about scheduling social time
Consider joining leagues, clubs, or organized activities
Use children's activities as networking opportunities
Household Management
Think of equity as reaching 100% as a team, not perfect 50-50 splits
Communicate openly about energy levels and capacity
Share both fun activities and challenging responsibilities
Model collaboration for children
Quality Time with Children
Focus on being present for short, meaningful periods rather than perfect all-day parenting
Find activities that naturally encourage conversation
Express both love and genuine enjoyment of your children's company
Address competitive behavior and perfectionism early
Personal Development
Evaluate what worked and didn't work in your own upbringing
Be intentional about defining your fathering approach
Seek inspiration from unexpected sources
Make time for personal interests and friendships
Stay connected
Joe Gidjunis continues his work exploring modern fatherhood through the "Grown Up Dad" series and welcomes support for the nonprofit production.
